Autor Wątek: "There are no answers. There are only Choices  (Przeczytany 80263 razy)

awariat

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #150 dnia: Lipiec 07, 2005, 11:33:39 pm »
Of course 99% of religion is bad and no origins are pure. But that doesn't mean some of the statements are good, thought by very good, wise people.
You say religion doesn't evolve? I think the reason why it is a pitfall is because it evolves, it should be simple and never change. If there were only the ten commandments, it would be enough. What else can you add, remove from that? Moses was one of the wisest men ever. His ten commandments have the same meaning now and 3000 years ago. No bull**** like killing goats and wearing funny hats. That does not server the purpose of a religion. It should be simple.Poly-solipsism lets you believe in whatever you want, but you will be your own judge. That's a tough judge :).

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #151 dnia: Lipiec 08, 2005, 05:30:23 am »
Lets return to Solaris; at least to the movie I saw with George Cloney. It is what brought me here in the first place.
If you missed the whispered words "There are no answers. There are only choices." uttered by the apparition of his friend, you missed the key to what the object Solaris was. At least from my point of view, with the concept of Poly-Solipsism firmly imbedded, and pretty much front and center in my mind, those whispered words explained how the object Solaris worked. It worked the very same way The Singularity works. Each mind generates its own illusions of Reality to exist in.

"We must project in order to perceive."
What thoughts, wishes, and memories were projected into Solaris were returned and perceived by the senses as being real. But they really were not real. It was only by looking at the subatomic structure the lie was revealed.

What we project into The Singularity is returned as our Reality. Our senses perceive it to be real. But if we look at the subatomic structure and venture down the rabbit hole below the Planck threshold into the quantum universe, it turns out our physical reality is made from no-thing at all. There are no solids in our solids, and no particles in our particles. It's all just Information pretending to be real.
The photon, along with the gluon and the W/Z particle are gauge bosons with no mass at all, yet they change our whole Universe. There sole function is to transfer Information from one place to another. The gauge boson is the information it carries and by transferring its information it changes one thing into another thing.
Everything we perceive as real is nothing more than the transfer of Information.

I am still convinced; until I hear Lem say otherwise, that Solaris was a dramatized version of Poly-Solipsism!
You can disagree all you want, but only Lem can speak for Lem.
We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!

wetal

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #152 dnia: Lipiec 08, 2005, 12:54:57 pm »
About religion and information we`ll, maybe, speak later.
 I`ve started to speak about philosophy `n religion.
 Indeed philosophy and religion is almost the same thing,they are interdependent.The base of each religion the philosophy is.
  People with atheistic outlook are not as atheistic as they think moreover they are pagans; atheism is based on a certain philosophic conception,this way each atheist has own religion and glorifies own gods.
  No philosophy can be a tool of learning, it`s more likely to be a MOTIVE to use own grey cells.
  Scientists like mideval heretics try to undermine philosophical and religious views.
  The Philosophy doesn`t state it supposes.
 

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #153 dnia: Lipiec 09, 2005, 05:36:44 am »
"The time has come," the Walrus said,
"To talk of many things:
Of shoes and ships and sealing-wax
Of cabbages and kings
And why the sea is boiling hot
And whether pigs have wings.


Charles Lutwidge Dodgson (Lewis Carroll). 1832-1898.

And this boys and girls is probably as good a description of philosophy as you can find anywhere!
The dates 1832 and 1898 are the years Charles Lutwidge Dodgson was born and died. It is the little dash ( - ) between them that is important. That little dash represents the years he lived.

Philosophies are beliefs, and Beliefs are philosophies. Religion is a belief and therefore is a philosophy. All our Science has it's roots in 600 BC Ionian Greek Philosophy. Science is a way of looking at our universe and our own existence, and trying to make sense of it all. Science is just as much a belief as any religion, and is therefore also a philosophy.

We exist. All else is philosophy!
We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!

wetal

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #154 dnia: Lipiec 14, 2005, 04:34:24 pm »
And we philosophize to find the reason of the existenze.
 Have you noticed that only unsatisfied people think about philosophhy?
 When we are happy we forget about the sense of life, we don`t think about it ,the same happens to philosophy.
 

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #155 dnia: Lipiec 14, 2005, 07:14:00 pm »
I'd like to state my mind about the sentence "There are no answers. There are only Choices" once and for all.
Let's call this sentence S, for short.  

If S  is true , than, it is inevitably true, regardless of what we think about it. So, one has no choice when deciding if S is true. So, it's not a matter of choice! But this contradicts with S itself, which states that everything is a matter of choice.

Contradiction. End of proof. S is not true (reductio ad absurdum).
« Ostatnia zmiana: Lipiec 14, 2005, 07:16:39 pm wysłana przez Terminus »

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #156 dnia: Lipiec 17, 2005, 05:02:17 am »
It's your Choice.  :)
We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!

wetal

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #157 dnia: Sierpień 09, 2005, 01:05:10 pm »
Cytuj

It's your Choice

One more zig-zag on the straight line.
We do it `cause we like it. Our life would be too boring without them.

afebk

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #158 dnia: Sierpień 29, 2005, 07:13:54 am »
Cytuj
It is the little dash ( - ) between them that is important. That little dash represents the years he lived.


Well, that just blew my mind.  During one of my stints in graduate school, I wrote a seminar paper on the hyphenated terms (politico-feminine is one I remember) used to discuss Nietzsche.  I don't remember much of it, except that I concluded that the hyphen (-) correlated to the 'uber' within the concept of the ubermensch.  As such it represented the crossing-over of the Abyss, and the lifelong commitment of the ubermensch to active nihilism.  That concept has since continued to rattle around in the back of my mind, and I always pay suspicious attention to hyphens.  Your reading of the hyphen as a representation of a man's life almost brings me to belive in the collective unconscoius!  Is it possible that my graduate work exists somewhere in the aether?

And to cckeiser, your argument has convinced me...I'm going to watch Solaris with your comments in mind.   Have you, by chance, read much of Richard Feynman?  

I apologize for posting to a thread that has been dormant, but I only just discovered it for myself.

AFK

Luca

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #159 dnia: Wrzesień 02, 2005, 02:40:17 pm »
Cytuj
Philosophies are beliefs, and Beliefs are philosophies. Religion is a belief and therefore is a philosophy. All our Science has it's roots in 600 BC Ionian Greek Philosophy. Science is a way of looking at our universe and our own existence, and trying to make sense of it all. Science is just as much a belief as any religion, and is therefore also a philosophy.


    Hold on for a moment. There is at least one, fundamental difference between science and religion/philosophy. I would call it decisive without any hesitation. Science is verifiable. It is also able to predict future states posteriori. To decribe it in short - science is a collection of questions that we can expect to be answered by nature, while philosophy/religion inhabits region that does not hold such hopes. In fact, if it did it wolud cease to be philosophy - verifiable theories are science!
    Haven`t you noticed differences in outcomes of philosophy and science? There is a joke pointing out that distinction, which says that physicists need lots of expensive equipment, mathematicians require only paper, pens and trash cans, while philosophers go even without trash cans...

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #160 dnia: Wrzesień 02, 2005, 08:28:21 pm »
Don't fight him, man, as you can see I've proven him that the main rule of his philosophy is a big fat contradiction, but this doesn't stop the man.

So, if logic and the rules of reason are of no importance for him, there's no point in reading this thread any more. As it was from the beginning.

wetal

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #161 dnia: Wrzesień 17, 2005, 01:03:25 pm »
 Allright now. You attack the guy from all sides.Have you asked yourselves why he expresses his thoughts here. Yes he`s a Lem`s reader.
 It is natural when someone develops a personal philosophical conception or a world conception."The world without answers" for instance. As for me I also have a view that crosses with Keiser`s in some way.
 You see that he speaks about the reality which every mind concerns to be real, the minds are different same happens to reality.
 Do you believe in ghosts and witches? I do not. But it doesn`t mean that there`s no people taking them real.You see the objects but it doesn`t mean that those objects are same to everybody. colorblind people live in purple environment though it is not purple and we can see the other colours of spectrum. So talking about human psychology I can agree with a statement that thre is no answers only choices whether to believe or not in the reality we live in.
 According to my conception the relity doesn`t exist,the view is not scientific but phylosophical , it happens really often that we idealize the surrounding so that it ceases to be real.If we were the robots without imagination there would be no idealzation and I would never agree with Keiser`s statement even partially.

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #162 dnia: Wrzesień 26, 2005, 04:03:53 am »
"It's up to you to choose grand beliefs, wondrous convictions, noble
purposes and lofty ideals. Then recognizing yourself as the final
source of all your meaning, belief and conviction will not degrade
into apathy and lack of meaning."
Gene Zimmer

Excerpt from: Reality, Belief and The Mind by Gene Zimmer

Universes and Reality

The world "out there", external reality, is a mutually shared universe
of common experience. It is the lowest common denominator of all our
experience. It is the mediocre minimum which we all take for granted
and it supplies us with a common field of action. That is all it is.
Your realm of personal "mind" is another sort of universe. You
experience it every second of every day. From here comes any and all
meaning about anything in the "outer" universe. The functions of
attention, concentration, imagination, responsibility, belief,
conviction, intention, decision, purpose, reason, intellect, and more
solely reside within your own personal "mind". These are qualities of
any mind. The "amount" of each and control we each have over these
various functions varies from person to person, and even within
ourselves from day to day. But they are there in each of us in some
form and to some degree. You may be influenced by the external world
of common experience, but this inner universe exists, is very real,
and is ultimately of more value than anything "out there". Why?
Because what happens "out there" depends completely on what you do (or
what "happens") with your own mind. In fact, your own inner universe
is the only thing capable anywhere of choosing and deciding value. The
world of external events takes shape in exact accordance with the sum
total of all Man's inner beliefs, conviction, ideas, meanings,
thoughts, desires, etc.

It is vital to get some grasp of this because Man's inner world , or
universe of thought, is very much ignored by all current popular
belief systems. This inner universe is the important universe and it
has been systematically ignored and suppressed by current
materialistic notions. The popularization and use of modern
psychological and psychiatric theories are the worse example of this.
When Man's inner universe is destroyed systematically through
institutionalized belief systems, Man can only finally become a pale
shadow of raw matter and energy - which in itself is dead, meaningless
and devoid of all life.

page 1
We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #163 dnia: Wrzesień 26, 2005, 04:05:36 am »
Page 2

Modern materialism has exaggerated the importance and power of the
external universe over the inner universe of Man's mind. Behaviorism
talks ad naseam about the effect of the environment on people. The
environment (external reality) is placed in a superior position above
the individual person (mind). People involve themselves in and dissect
the physical universe in a futile attempt to gain "understanding".
They think the answers lie outside themselves. Again, all meaning,
purpose and value for anything, is determined by your mind and for
you, by your mind alone. You are the most truth you will ever know
about anything as you are the ONLY source of truth for everything you
experience. In the end, whatever you end up believing "in" or "about"
is fundamentally an action of your own mind to attach meaning and
significance to something. It's an action of an individual mind.

You are the complete source of meaning for you. You might explain, "I
believe this because it's so true, and it makes me feel good, and
blah-blah-blah...", and you may attribute your choice to all manner of
reasoning about ideas, external events and situations, but in the end
YOU SIMPLY DECIDE TO BELIEVE and EXPERIENCE MEANING solely by your own
mental actions. We all tend to take our cues from external events, and
our beliefs often follow reactions to events, but this isn't
necessary. The function of believing and developing conviction could
be separate from one's experiences of external reality, and if you
suddenly found yourself in some other reality, on some other world,
somewhere else, you would simply begin responding to the external
events there, and develop new beliefs accordingly. This is as true for
science as it is for religion. It is true for everything. Ultimately,
nothing is true unless you believe it to be so. And for you, it then
is. But you are the source of the meaning - the source is not anything
you conceive yourself to experience "out there", whether an observable
"thing" or an "idea".

The purpose of pointing this out is not to make you feel as if all is
useless and meaningless, although this will be the result as long as
you look for meaning outside yourself and fail to acknowledge your own
direct participation in the creation of belief, conviction and meaning
for your own personal experience. It's up to you to choose grand
beliefs, wondrous convictions, noble purposes and lofty ideals. Then
recognizing yourself as the final source of all your meaning, belief
and conviction will not degrade into apathy and lack of meaning. Most
people search "out there" to find something to "believe in", and to
give their life meaning, but in the end, it is your own action of
establishing belief which underlies any choice or decision. Again,what you accept to believe need not correspond to any pre-packaged
theory, concept or philosophy, whether scientific, philosophical or
religious, but we all tend to take for granted that the existing
options presented to us are the only possibilities available. But this
is difficult to do in a world where Man's inner world and all it does
is so casually and persistently denied. It is also difficult to do
when so many external forces attempt to sell you on their own specific
set of opinions and beliefs. Everybody is trying to get you to accept
their patterns of belief and systems of meaning.
We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!

cckeiser

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Re: "There are no answers. There are only Cho
« Odpowiedź #164 dnia: Wrzesień 26, 2005, 04:06:47 am »
page 3

This is the real battle occurring on planet Earth. The winners and
losers of this battle are what truly determine the "evolution" of
societies and the world. Now, and in the past, most of what is being
sold is trash, as it usually denies and oppresses that which is
capable of believing and attaching meaning - you and your mind. Your
mind and everyone else's minds are the true source of any quality of
life that will ever exist. Solely and completely. Recognition,
education into the functions, and empowerment of minds results in
success, decency, morality, strength, sanity and greatness. Denial and
suppression of these things results in failure, perversions,
immorality, weakness, insanity and mediocrity. Materialism as a belief
system has the effect of denying these things.

Excerpt from:

Reality, Belief and The Mind
by Gene Zimmer

©Gene Zimmer 1999 ALL RIGHTS RESERVED





We exist. All else is Philosophy.

There are no answers. There are only Choices!